Romanavs and the fall of tsarism

Levi Taylor
Levi Taylor

Can anyone help a brainlette understand the downfall of the Romanovs and tsarism in Russia right before and during the revolution in general? I tried watching a couple of documentaries but they're oozing with revisionism trying to paint Nicolas as "a,good man who was in the wrong place at the wrong time" and making the various radical movements at the time appear as a minority of the population as if everyone loved tsarism and capitalism and were simply tricked by the Left etc standard boomer mindset shit

Anyway I have a general understanding of how Russia worked under the Communist party at various stages and a vague understanding of the conditions that triggered worker and peasant unrest but my specific questions are:
1) Exactly how were the romanovs and other tsarist elites treated immediately after the October revolution
2) how much of a piece of shit was Nicolas personally and how much historical revisionism has been done to make him appear as a benevolent leader (I know this isn't really worth anything from a materialist perspective but I'm. curious)
3) how did Russian tsarism and feudalism compare to other monarchies and fuedal societies in Europe and why did it take so long for capitalism to emerge in Russia and why was it so limited when it did emerge
4) Does rasputin have any real purpose to the larger romanovs story or is he just a meme

Also you can discuss whatever other things you wish about tsarism and the romanovs from a leftist perspective here I guess

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Levi Myers
Levi Myers

1) depends, I mean people like Brusilov were accepted into the Red Army, others were shot, some forced into exile. It's really a mixed bag depending on what they did when and where they came from.
2) Nicholas was a bogstandard monarchic autocrat: he wasn't especially cruel but fuck me was he incompetent. Like Bloody Sunday only happened because he fled the Winter Palace like a little bitchboi and the Cossacks had no command. He was also thick-as-shit since that entire movement up until that point were loyalist to him to a high degree. But considering what he did afterwards, execution was justified.
3) Russia was so backwards because it never had a legislature made-up of landowners. That is it, there was no push for reform by the burger class since Ivan Ivanovich crushed the Zemskiy Sobor. This kept Russia in permanent feudal autocracy mode until it got its shit kicked-in in Crimea which only then did it abolish serfdom: but it was too late by that point and was doomed to fall during its industrialisation.
4) mostly a meme, he was a convenient scapegoat for the aristocracy so they didn't have to deal with their own failings. It is important to note shit started falling apart in Russia once he was killed because they aristocracy no-longer had someone to blame all their military failures in WWI on.
Also, thread theme; youtu.be/SYnVYJDxu2Q

Camden Ross
Camden Ross

Listen to the audiobook 'Oktober' by China Mieville, its on youtube. Its really amazing, entertaining and left-wing take on the events of 1917.

Michael Sanders
Michael Sanders

Exactly how were the romanovs and other tsarist elites treated immediately after the October revolution
They were put under house arrest in various mansions and palaces across the country. They were moved around a lot to prevent the whites from finding them.
how much of a piece of shit was Nicolas personally and how much historical revisionism has been done to make him appear as a benevolent leader
He wasn’t. He was a Marie Antoinette tier snob who hated his people and treated them like insolent children. He was infuriated by demands for even the most basic reforms like the creation of a parliament. He also turned a blind eye to pogroms and crushing poverty, as well as putting countless millions into the WW1 meat grinder.
how did Russian tsarism and feudalism compare to other monarchies and fuedal societies in Europe and why did it take so long for capitalism to emerge in Russia and why was it so limited when it did emerge
Russia was remote and backwards, but why feudalism clung on so long there as opposed to say, Germany, I’m not sure.
Does rasputin have any real purpose to the larger romanovs story or is he just a meme
He’s an interesting dude, but in the grand scheme of things he wasn’t important. He was just an advisor ultimately, one of many. The only difference was he was a Siberian wizard who banged the Empress and died dramatically.

Isaac Perry
Isaac Perry

1. Legal abolishment of their status though a lot fled the country.
2. Nicolas II was largely liberal-ish for a Tzar right up until it bit him in the ass (notably allowing minorities to attend universities which resulted in them engaging in political agitation and leading riots which led him to ignore later pogroms) and by the revolutionary times was kind of marginalized in power by the nobility/bureacracy as his own earlier actions pissed them off so that part's not as terribly wrong as it's made out to be even if it can be played up too much as sainthood by some.
3. Always hard to do but you can consider them more entrenched than most due to how late they were in abolishing serfdom and by extension weakening the grip of the nobility.
4. Historical meme that arose out of propaganda needs mostly.

Jacob Ward
Jacob Ward

Nicolas II was largely liberal-ish for a Tzar
Lol, no. He was a pussy, but by convictions, he was the most reactionary tzar in the dynasty's history. No Russian ruler did something like basing their policies on assuming the Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion to be true. Likewise, everytime he saw an opportunity to grab some power, he took it.

Ryder Ortiz
Ryder Ortiz

brutally murdering an entire family and kids

Levi Martinez
Levi Martinez

His father was even more reactionary.

Gabriel Sullivan
Gabriel Sullivan

Half a dozen - dozen people being shot bullets at is somehow worthy of remorse and deep consideration, all the while 10s of millions are dying all around in a gristly fashion.

Caleb Gomez
Caleb Gomez

Is there a problem?

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Nathaniel Reed
Nathaniel Reed

citizens are in horrific conditions
police open fire on and massacre them
go on vacation
people become even more furious
eventually get executed

There you go

Luis Cooper
Luis Cooper

Nicholas and his family were 20th century Marie-Antoinettes. Partying and hunting while everything around them fell apart, then telling peasants to eat cake and hoping God will set everything right. I've read Nicholas and the Tsarina's letters and it's just sad. Nicky wasn't as much of a malicious tyrant like his father, as he was just kind of a brainlet. Even when already deposed and living in exile he had no idea what's going on. Just chopping wood, reading the Bible and believing that the revolution is just a temporary nuisance that will go away any moment now. Russian reactionaries and state propaganda spin it as Nicky being a "honest, loyal family man" but it just shows how utterly disconnected the Russian royalty was from reality. Romanov diaries and letters are mandatory reading for modern monarchists (lel) who believe that "monarchy is the best way to govern because monarchs are brought up to rule".

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Nathaniel Sanchez
Nathaniel Sanchez

a family brutally murdering working people in masses throughout europe
ftfy

Jordan Russell
Jordan Russell

b-but think about the children ;_;
oh please, the tsarists were responsible for suppressing the entire Russian people, including many women and children. Nicky's children would have been next in-line for the throne, so it was way safer for the Bolsheviks to get rid of them. they got to live in luxury on the ashes of the working class and would have followed in their fathers footsteps and been just as bad, but we're supposed to feel bad for them just because they weren't adults yet? once again, what about the millions of children who grew up impoverished and died? are the deaths of children only important if we know their names and if they are royalty? the Romanov's got off easy, they could have suffered a lot more than they ultimately did and it still wouldn't have been on the same level as the average working class Russian spending their whole lives in poverty. get fucked.

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Isaac Allen
Isaac Allen

Blame fuedalism. The children would have been used as puppets by monarchists eventually. They can be seen as martyrs for USSR. The tsar and his bitch wife got what they deserved though.

Andrew Baker
Andrew Baker

What about the millions of Russian children ground into the dust by poverty and war on the Romanov’s watch?

Isaac Gonzalez
Isaac Gonzalez

the MAGA teens proved to me that children aren't innocent

Adam Green
Adam Green

Also, thread theme; youtu.be/SYnVYJDxu2Q

shurely
youtube.com/watch?v=huXNdLQt_bk

Ian Green
Ian Green

I prefer my rasputin in beer form

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Joseph Perez
Joseph Perez

1) Exactly how were the romanovs and other tsarist elites treated immediately after the October revolution

Depends. Romanovs were shot, but they were pretty obstinate about abdicating. The reactionaries were already rallying around the tsars brother after naming him heir. It probably needed to happen.

2) how much of a piece of shit was Nicolas personally and how much historical revisionism has been done to make him appear as a benevolent leader (I know this isn't really worth anything from a materialist perspective but I'm. curious)

After reading Trotsky's account, I've come to the conclusion he was incredibly callous. He called it a type of spiritual decay. His diary was vapidly mundane despite everything tumbling down around him. Yes, he wasn't as malicious as his predecessors, but the belief in his divine right led him to be brutal. It's not a perfect comparison, but it reminds me of how some borgs can be perfectly tame in company, but commit atrocities because of their place in society, and whole heartedly believe they are right. I think there's a lot of revisionism by bourgeois scholars to make him seem like some kind of poor dupe, despite also being a monster in his own right.

3) how did Russian tsarism and feudalism compare to other monarchies and fuedal societies in Europe and why did it take so long for capitalism to emerge in Russia and why was it so limited when it did emerge

During that period of time, it was kind of unique in that it was half feudalism and half capitalism. Most people expected there to be a liberal revolution before a communist one, but because the liberal reformist were failing to meet people's needs, the communist won out,

4) Does rasputin have any real purpose to the larger romanovs story or is he just a meme

He and his camarilla did have a lot of influence. There's no denying that. I remember reading that Nikolai Tagantsev said that it would have been necessary to invent a Rasputin if he didn't exist. I think his death was more of a sign of weakness which emboldened the revolutionaries, more than anything. Probably to people at the time, it didn't help that he was fucking princesses and getting drunk every day, while everyone else was starving and dying in wars he was having undue say in. He was kind of emblematic of the excesses of the upper crust. Also, motherfucker just looks like a creepy evil wizard antichrist. People were also really turned off by the religious sect he belonged to, Khlysts, because of its views on sex and sin.

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Carson Carter
Carson Carter

Also, forgot to mention, the Tsar is more to blame for getting his family killed than anyone. He had plenty of time to abdicate the throne, but refused.

Xavier Scott
Xavier Scott

thats a good beer, actually

Caleb Hughes
Caleb Hughes

I know. I've had it a good few times.

Josiah Collins
Josiah Collins

Rasputin is christbol gang
t. Fox Animation Studios

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Ayden Taylor
Ayden Taylor

watch fall of eagles
youtube.com/watch?v=0aHatkDaWew

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