WWIII Thread

Kayden Howard
Kayden Howard

Saw the huge thread watching the Market turn into a general thread on the next crisis of capitalism, so I figured we should have a thread on the increasingly aggressive political crisis fomenting between the different imperialist powers and the war-cry they’re shouting against each other and China

Looks like the oncoming crisis of capitalism + environmental crisis might force a third redivision of the world between the imperialist methinks

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Other urls found in this thread:

reuters.com/article/us-usa-oil-eia/in-major-shift-us-now-exports-more-oil-than-it-ships-in-idUSKBN1O51X7
twitter.com/iww_iwoc?lang=en
labornotes.org/jasic
www-m.cnn.com/2019/05/16/politics/donald-trump-iran-john-bolton-mike-pompeo/index.html?r=https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-m&q=trump+mad+bolton+iran+cnn&oq=trump+mad+bolton+iran+cnn&aqs=heirloom-srp..&rm=1
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norwegian_rocket_incident).

Noah Bailey
Noah Bailey

Maybe some shit will go down in Iran but I doubt it. Anybody have some good draft dodging tips just in case?

Eli Smith
Eli Smith

Don't dodge the draft dude, take bootcamp then defect over to the other side. Or flee into Iraq or Pakistan depending on which border you're deployed from

Lincoln Reed
Lincoln Reed

defect
or talk about politics with the rest of your unit so a bunch of you will be in a position to all do something
There were a shitloads of soldiers in viet nam who assassinated officers. There have been numerous cases of disobeying orders or deserting at a crucial time and saving lives.

Andrew Brooks
Andrew Brooks

What if you tried and the Iranian military just shot you on sight as an imperialist invader? IMO the right move is to acknowledge an invasion of Iran would hasten US Balkanization and where to move from there

James Davis
James Davis

US Balkanization
nice meme

Cooper Foster
Cooper Foster

What if you tried and the Iranian military just shot you on sight as an imperialist invader?
then that'd be at least one more opportunist unable to cause anymore trouble.

Jaxson Anderson
Jaxson Anderson

Uncle sams taking us on a boat ride destination IRAN!!!

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Jose Butler
Jose Butler

they wouldnt actually do a draft would they?

Carter Taylor
Carter Taylor

What if you tried and the Iranian military just shot you on sight as an imperialist invader?

be American
get shot
lmao

Colton Myers
Colton Myers

Nope, they're going to outsource most of the war to Blackwater and other mercenary groups, or just people on Haj the Saudis kidnap and conscript.

Cameron Harris
Cameron Harris

No, they have enough people who would volunteer. Besides they would need more people on the homefront making planes. If the US goes to war with Iran your average burger is more likely to get sent to prison for a BS charge and forced to work in a F-35 factory during Prison time than be conscripted. Reminder that in the US prisoners are used as a labor force.

Asher Parker
Asher Parker

Sabotage and unionize the prisons

Kevin Morgan
Kevin Morgan

How long before ICE gets privatized and turned into literal Untermenschen slave factories?

Daniel Collins
Daniel Collins

Hopefully, I want an end to this malaise and my virginity. Through fiery death.

Matthew Rivera
Matthew Rivera

Nice LARP, there will never be war with Iran, the MO nowadays is to fund insurgent groups, civil wars, coups, and assassinations. See Libya for a modern day example of what US "war" looks like.

Gabriel Jackson
Gabriel Jackson

They've been trying this in Iran for years, no rebel groups have the popular constituency to fulfill Washington's desires

Liam Cook
Liam Cook

They've been trying this in Iran for years
Not seriously, their efforts have been focused elsewhere. Look no further than the Arab Spring. Given time, a refocused effort will eventually bring the Iranians down- especially once Russian leadership changes. Even that maniac Bolton understands that attacking that natural mountain fortress would be a disaster.

Gavin Lopez
Gavin Lopez

why don't we just go full accelerationist already? I mean its not like anyone is actually committing any real praxis here in burgerland despite it being the most dysfunctional "first world" nation.

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James Parker
James Parker

draft dodging
no user, in the event of the draft we have one of the most spectacular opportunities for change in the US: a mass military for the first time since Vietnam. In such a situation, you cannot use the military to crush domestic opposition without risking a mutiny.

If you're drafted, go in and prepare to do what needs to be done when the moment calls for it.

Evan Cook
Evan Cook

radicalizing your unit actually sounds like a decent idea ngl

Christopher Cox
Christopher Cox

sounds a little larpy

Angel Sanders
Angel Sanders

this tbh

Colton Campbell
Colton Campbell

The market crash is looming, things haven't even properly started yet.

Daniel Howard
Daniel Howard

as an individual you wouldn't be doing much. but it's important to have socialists involved in such a mass military to seize on discontent. The world may have been very different if there were more comitted socialists among the sailors mutining in germany after WW1.

Joseph Bell
Joseph Bell

why don't we just go full accelerationist already?
I think this is juvenile. It's much more likely that exceedingly rapid deterioration of economic conditions will lead to fascism, and this is especially the case in America. From my perspective, I see Americans worshiping a pseudo-fascist technocracy a la Amazon, with their drone delivery system and their increasing investment into the agricultural sector (vertical farms). It's very very difficult for me to imagine some communist rebellion against some paternal figure like Bezos that has ruthlessly out-competed the aging 80s era agricultural industry.

Blake Jackson
Blake Jackson

It's much more likely that exceedingly rapid deterioration of economic conditions will lead to fascism
Well the popular opinion among burger politics is that within the comign years well be changing systems due to the shitstain that is neo-liberalism. All its really done is fuck over the working class and made people worship "muh free market" like a religion.
It's very very difficult for me to imagine some communist rebellion against some paternal figure like Bezos
thank you for reminding me that Americas fucked. :)

Joshua Sanders
Joshua Sanders

the world is wrong the world is wrong the world is wrong the world is wrong the world is wrong the world is wrong the world is wrong the world is wrong the world is wrong the world is wrong lets overthrow the fucking government the world is wrong the world is wrong the world is wrong the world is wrong the world is wrong the world is wrong the world is wrong the world is wrong the world is wrong the world is wrong

Ryder Williams
Ryder Williams

Tumbling Down Tumbling Down
Tumbling Down Tumbling Down
Tumbling Down Tumbling Down
Tumbling Down Tumbling Down
Tumbling Down Tumbling Down
Tumbling Down Tumbling Down

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Charles Evans
Charles Evans

It's very very difficult for me to imagine some communist rebellion against some paternal figure like Bezos that has ruthlessly out-competed the aging 80s era agricultural industry.
The majority of burgers fucking hate Bezos. The leader of such a technocracy would have to be someone else.

Samuel Garcia
Samuel Garcia

Trump is one of the few politicians leftist enough to stand up to Chinese fascism. Efforts to make it look like doing so would involve war are moronic. The Soviet Union needed its external connections *less* desperately and still fell eventually to peaceful economic and diplomatic pressures. If China will not stop humiliating itself with smog and inequality, it deserves to be hit with and indeed will very eventually be more prosperous if afflicted with international economic pressures. China needs to have pride enough to protect labor and the environment! They need to stop blaming foreigners for the humiliating fruit of their own dishonesty and fascistic policies!

Owen Morales
Owen Morales

If we aren’t willing to defend the world against fascism, WW3 becomes likely.

If we use existing international tools of peaceful influence, we can avoid that.

Do it for globalism! Cease tolerating a slavestate and end the race to the bottom that has been crashing the prosperity of workers globally!

Luke Jones
Luke Jones

Hmm, I do wonder though, you think the final revolution would more or less look like WWIII anyway?

Jordan Ramirez
Jordan Ramirez

China is literally not an actual socialist state. It’s fascist. An insulated and very wealthy ownership class keeps the workers enslaved and breathing smog. Reciprocate the firewall! Tolerating fascism is an existential risk!

Benjamin Long
Benjamin Long

No. There’s no need of a final revolution. We need only be equal enough for the final progress of technology. Science proves the finite differentiation between all people and finds places for everyone on what will ultimately be shallow hierarchies due to superior prosperity enabled thereby.

Hudson Ortiz
Hudson Ortiz

Reminder that China literally banned Marxist.com

Aiden Bell
Aiden Bell

Consider: it will eventually be possible to replace every part of a person with new biology. It will be possible to replace all component pieces. Will we not seek to achieve upgrades when we do that? Who does society most desperately seek to upgrade?

The poor, the criminal, the “worthless”, these people soak huge amounts of resources as society tries to make something of them.

What then will happen when we can make something of anyone in a cost-efficient way? Will society abruptly abandon its struggle to redeem the expensively worthless people who waste money returning nothing across the country and in prisons? Will that be abandoned? Or will the business of redemption make sudden gains in cost-efficiency?

Economics rules the world. Science will squish the differences between people sooner or later. Sooner, if people do not “accelerate”, but seek actively to enable the shallower hierarchy.

Charles Thompson
Charles Thompson

they would have enough volunteers
No they wouldnt nobody likes Trump nobody wants a war with Iran nobody I know and nobody serious except Bolton and the white house. The media isnt manufacturing consent for a war there is no climate of fear like there was after 9/11 European allies wont support this not even the UK if America attacks Iran with no justification it's over for America as a world power the global economy would crash because Hormuz would be blocked regardless you would need at least 500k men to fight and occupy Iran which the US doesnt have since it's already critically overextended

Zachary Mitchell
Zachary Mitchell

So hopefully burgerland will have to hold back its ravenous appetite is what you’re saying?

Adrian Rivera
Adrian Rivera

Burger land literally can't hold back, its economy is based entirely around the appetite for "creative destruction" and neo colonialism, both at home and abroad

Hudson Green
Hudson Green

Oh, you're a dumb liberal.

Jacob Smith
Jacob Smith

Burgerland is bluffing. Flumpf is trying to gunboat diplomacy Iran into submitting to a new Iran deal where they get no nukes on top of giving up Syria Hezbollah Hamas and Yemen he doesnt want an actual war to happen imo

Angel Howard
Angel Howard

But Trump doesn't really know much about international politics, tbh. If anyone's running the show, it's Pompeio and Bolton, not orange man. And Bolton doesn't fuck around.
Here's what's going to happen:
A: Both sides will play tough until something (missile attack, Mossad, Houthi dronewars, etc.) happens, which Iran will be blamed for. Tensions will reach a high point and someone miscalculates, triggering a conflict in the Persia Gulf.
…And/or:
B: The US shoots down another airliner.

Screencap this

Jaxson Collins
Jaxson Collins

Bolton does though, and elements in Iran (particularly Rev Guard generals) are itching to give the US a bloody nose. Remember how fast these things can spiral out of control. I’m sure the Austrians in August of 1914 just wanted a quick curb stomp of Serbia, not a 4 year long bloodbath.

Jacob Torres
Jacob Torres

Bolton cant start a war He cant even order US troops around this all has to be signed off by the Pentagon and the approved by Trump himself. Trump wont start another war imo. The military also doesn't want another war. It could start accidentally however but this will not do any good to US interests Hormuz is like 30km wide any military activity there shuts down shipping there which is like 8 million barrels of oil a day which kills the global economy including the US economy that's even before fighting a ground war vs Iran and all the ramifications of that

Wyatt Moore
Wyatt Moore

Consider: it will eventually be possible to replace every part of a person with new biology. It will be possible to replace all component pieces

No that is ludicrous, biology is shaped by possible path-ways it can grow into. For example birds cannot grow jet-turbines even if there were kerosene berries, because the spinning part of the turbine would be detached and would need to be a semi independent life form.

To an extend there is molecular machinery operating at the lower levels where you can plug out components and switch them for better stuff, this will be a boon for health-care or better yet sick-prevention-care. However a lot of stuff in biology is ridiculously interdependent and multifunctional. On top of that is that biology is not independent from environment, so you have to take a phenotypical view where the biological function of your body will vary based on environmental inputs about as much as it depends on the components.

There is some room for some optimization, you probably can ad an avian lung inspired breathing system for higher oxygen supply efficiency, and do stuff like make vascular-system contract and expand in a travelling wave motion to move blood more effectively and also function in a way to be a redundancy for the heart and prevent bleeding out in case of injury. Obviously you'd want to be able to do photosynthesis in your skin, and have zoom lenses in your eyes as well as have a wider spectrum light sensitivity. But these are sort of the easy dials you can turn. Consider that a lot of the stuff related to intelligence and behaviour is collective in nature, where you start to manipulate a system that has the bodies of multiple people as components. This is opening a can of worms, because now you are designing people to have different but complementary biology, that also responds to the environment.

The poor, the criminal, the “worthless”, these people soak huge amounts of resources as society tries to make something of them.
Your conceptual idea of fixing the worthless people, is based on a one sided view where you want to adapt people to fit in what ever way you measure worth, and you have to consider what system you want to change, it might be easier to modify the surroundings of people than to modify people.

Economics rules the world. Science will squish the differences between people sooner or later.

Well maybe there will be a sort of coalescing to standard body, but it is likely that after this it will be something like a basis for diverging developments quite possible forced by space travel.

We also have to account for the limitations of genetic editing, which only acts in a very limited way, and spurs fears of changing the genetic basis for humanity that seems to be somehow tied into some deep-rooted fears about essence of self. It might be easier to add modifiers that reconfigure biology on various non genetic levels of the body that are not permanent, much more versatile, and a lot cheaper to manage, because it's not trapped in organic pathways as much.

Consider that making everybody have the same body and as you say squish all differences might not lead to more equality. Because right know we have enormous inequality and class stratification that is not related to the bodies of people at all. Consider that the tendency of generating inequalities based on bodies could be more effectively-countered when people with different biological nature, can have modifiers that allows them to negate differences that are the basis for discrimination more effectively. Consider that the ideas that arise from breeding stock and traits of individuals are unlikely to be effective models since they predate science and had their utility for modelling reality in terms of attempting to optimize combining breading partners to produce offspring of organisms towards narrow goals for "utility animals/plants" With the tools that are being developed now and in the future will not have the same tendencies and produce new patterns.

Cameron Foster
Cameron Foster

you would need at least 500k men to fight and occupy Iran which the US doesnt have since it's already critically overextended
the US is a country with 300 MILLION people, they will find enough manpower.
there which is like 8 million barrels of oil a day which kills the global economy including the US economy
No it won’t. The US is a net oil exporter. All they have to do to survive Iran blocking off the straight of Hormuz is ban oil exports.

Isaac Taylor
Isaac Taylor

Trotcuck you have consistently bad takes on everything it's like you're trying to sound dumb on purpose. The US could nuke Iran with ICBM's as well it's not feasible for 1000 different reasons just as them finding 500k men is not feasible politically they would need to go to Congress to approve funding for this which they will never get nobody wants another war and occupation in the Middle East by America. The US still imports a quarter of its oil from the Gulf so clearly it's not an exporter but it doesnt matter because the oil price will jump at least to 120 dollars a barrel so for every major industry and company in the world thats double the bill which will kill the global econo.y which in turn will cause another global recession including one in the US

Landon Lee
Landon Lee

Orangman wont start a war. Unless hes an insane retard but he would have done it earlier if he was. This is all happening I the media there are no 120k troops that's what the Pentagon wants to deploy in the ME and prepare for war with Iran knowing full well they will never get 120k they will never get even 30k there qont be a war they have deployed a carrier group to the ME which they do all the time

Sebastian Edwards
Sebastian Edwards

reuters.com/article/us-usa-oil-eia/in-major-shift-us-now-exports-more-oil-than-it-ships-in-idUSKBN1O51X7

Jacob Taylor
Jacob Taylor

The US consumes 20 million barrels a day and exports 211 thousand a day. Price doubles not only for the 211 thousand but the 20 million as well

Angel Perry
Angel Perry

oncoming
you mean ongoing?
we've been in world war 3 since 2003 illegal iraq invasion. right now the theater is Syria on a micro scale, but all major powers have concentration camps with millions of occupants and fucking are in illegal wars.
how about no?
the detention centers are already privatized
the draft
you people seem not to know how war works, armies no longer stand in a line and fire at each other, the process has sort of become automated

Kayden Ramirez
Kayden Ramirez

Why not unionize prisons? Just because you're a criminal doesn't mean you deserve 10 cents an hour for the work you do

Brody Cooper
Brody Cooper

twitter.com/iww_iwoc?lang=en
This tbh.

Matthew Turner
Matthew Turner

Tfw I’m a socialist but so bourgeois that I fear allowing the slave labor force of the West into my movement

Oliver Perry
Oliver Perry

You'll need a draft of you're gonna occupy Iran. You need a lot of troops that the US doesnt currently have unless they scale down their presence everywhere else

Camden Williams
Camden Williams

Let’s be honest, all the US Army has to do to increase manpower is raise soldier’s pay.

Ayden Jones
Ayden Jones

Why didnt they just do that for Vietnam then?

Thomas Hughes
Thomas Hughes

Because they though the Draft would work, it didn’t. Therefore they will do something different this time around.

Brody Wilson
Brody Wilson

The key element to understand the process that the USA will enter in the upcoming decade is migration. In the past, specially in the 20th century, the key factor that allowed the USA to rise to its colossus status was immigration with the benefits of a demographic expansion supporting the credit expansion and the brain drain from the rest of the world benefiting the States. The collapse of the Western financial system will wipe out the standard of living of its population while ending ponzi schemes such as the stock exchange and the pension funds. The population will be hit so badly by a full array of bubbles and ponzi schemes that the migration engine will start to work in reverse accelerating itself due to ripple effects thus leading to the demise of the States. This unseen situation for the States will develop itself in a cascade pattern with unprecedented and devastating effects for the economy. Jobs offshoring will surely end with many American Corporations relocating overseas thus becoming foreign Corporations!!!! We see a significant part of the American population migrating to Latin America and Asia while migration to Europe - suffering a similar illness - won't be relevant. Nevertheless the death toll will be horrible. Take into account that the Soviet Union's population was poorer than the Americans nowadays or even then. The ex-Soviets suffered during the following struggle in the 1990s with a significant death toll and the loss of national pride. Might we say "Twice the pride, double the fall"? Nope. The American standard of living is one of the highest, far more than double of the Soviets while having added a services economy that will be gone along with the financial system. When pensioners see their retirement disappear in front of their eyes and there are no servicing jobs you can imagine what is going to happen next. At least younger people can migrate. Never in human history were so many elders among the population. In past centuries people were lucky to get to their 30s or 40s. The American downfall is set to be far worse than the Soviet Union's one. A confluence of crisis with a devastating result.

The Demographic crisis in the former Soviet Union countries has extended for over two decades, if we accept that it ended early in this decade (2010s). The demographic crisis will hit the World in the near future and is projected to last between three and eight decades more or less depending on technological breakthrough and environmental issues. The aftermath is more likely a frozen picture with the population numbers staying the same for a very, very long period of time. The countries forecast population numbers do reflect birth/deaths but also migratory movements. Many countries are going to increase their gross population due to immigration while their native population may shrink.

Over the past two thousand years we have witnessed the Western civilization built around the Mediterranean Sea shifting to Northern Europe and then by the mid 20th century shifting to an Atlantic axis to finally get centered into the States in the past 30 years. The next move will see the civilization being centered in Asia with Russia and China on top. Historically a change in the economic paradigm has resulted in a death toll that is rarely highlighted by mainstream historians. When the transition from rural areas to large cities happened in Europe many people unable to accept the new paradigm killed themselves. They killed themselves by a psychological factor. This is not mainstream but it is true. A new crisis joins old, well known patterns with new ones.

Sorry to disappoint many of you with our forecast. It is getting worse and worse every year since the beginning of the pre-crisis in 2007.

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Connor Adams
Connor Adams

If they could have raised salaries they would have done so. A lance corporal in the USMC gets paid like 25k a year if they raised that to 30k I doubt it would raise their enthusiasm to go die in the sandbox but if they just raised it across the board that's billions and billions of dollars that need a sign off from Congress which wont happen

Ian Nguyen
Ian Nguyen

but if they just raised it across the board that's billions and billions of dollars that need a sign off from Congress which wont happen
Last year they just increased the military budget by 80 billion.

Joseph Moore
Joseph Moore

80 billion is like a drop in the Pentagon piss bucket tho. Did that go to new equipment or raising salaries remember they have massive fuel costs massive logistical costs etc they need 10 million a day just to keep one carrier operational

Blake Martin
Blake Martin

Fuck off you idiot shill

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Daniel Gray
Daniel Gray

Marxist.com, the website of the International Marxist Tendency, is indeed blocked.

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William Mitchell
William Mitchell

good

Gabriel Long
Gabriel Long

They're Trots, of course they are blocked. You tried to construe that China bans it's own leading ideology when in fact they only banned a tendency hostile to them.

Samuel Morales
Samuel Morales

why would someone just go on the internet and lie

Zachary Diaz
Zachary Diaz

socialism is when you brutally suppress workers' struggles on behalf of literal billionaires
labornotes.org/jasic
and before you go turbotankie on me, the students in solitary confinement aren't trots, they're self-avowed Maoists

Jayden Lopez
Jayden Lopez

They're Trots, of course they are blocked.
Marxists.com doesn’t have an ideological bent. All it does if give people free .pdf files of Marxist texts. Of all tendencies.
If a trotskyist revolution occurred, the country in which it would occur would not ban Mao’s “Little Red-Book”

Jason Ramirez
Jason Ramirez

Bolton

why are there no assassinations anymore

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Jace White
Jace White

With the USSR gone the CIA is surprisingly flaccid

Guess they needed that Soviet Bear breathing down their necks to be semi-competent

Jayden Evans
Jayden Evans

Yeah, it would immediately split into fifty-seven smaller countries.

Thomas Wilson
Thomas Wilson

That would also all be at war tbh

Ethan Howard
Ethan Howard

Marxists.com doesn’t have an ideological bent. All it does if give people free .pdf files of Marxist texts. Of all tendencies.
You're thinking of marxists.org. Idk if marxist.com actually is trots or whatever but that's not a good reason to be banning it anyway

Easton Perez
Easton Perez

I doubt that Trump would start World War 3. If anything it would be a Democrat.

And they would help Germany conquer France, England, Russia

Carter Perry
Carter Perry

There were a shitloads of soldiers in viet nam who assassinated officers.
That was before the invention of helmet cams d00t.

Jacob Myers
Jacob Myers

But how many babies will you have killed before you radicalulzed your unit?

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Leo Gonzalez
Leo Gonzalez

implying ill be the one killing babies
implying all soldiers are bad despite it being one of the main ways for people to pay for tuition so they're forced into it either by friends, family, or society.
I'm aware that soldiers are used mainly for imperialism and other capitalist bullshit but its not like they're all clones that all think the same thing. Its also not like you can explain to other retards in your unit that maybe killing civilians is bad.

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Kayden Taylor
Kayden Taylor

Two out of the three soldiers I know told me they killed babies while in service. One of them was vietnam and didnt tell me much except they would mow down the jungle with machine gun fire from their gun boats as they cruised down the river. I assume he later saw the results of one of their blindfire exercises from his statement "i killed babies over there user." The second was an Iraq vet who told our class about how his squad was raiding a house when they took fire and one of his team got hit. They were then clearing the house room by room when he heard movent in a room so he chucked a nade in through the door. After it went off and he looked inside ot was a dead mother and child. Last vet I know is a childhood friend who was a mine sweeper in afghanistan and last we spoke he was trying to become a medic. Maybe he killed babies too and he just didn't want to tell me, dunno. So yeah becime a minesweeper or a medic or join chair force or the gayvy if you dont want to directly murder bavies I guess user.

Lucas Cruz
Lucas Cruz

Iran is going to humiliate the US into a political crisis or push trump into using nukes. In either case it's happening.

Jayden Ward
Jayden Ward

OP here, didn’t use Trump’s image cuz he’ll start WWIII, I don’t think he will, he’s just dismantling the international system post-1945 and also post-1991 setting up the underlying reasons for a WWIII a decade or two from now

Gavin Adams
Gavin Adams

Didn’t Trump just cuck out on Iran when the real power in the MIC told him what a disaster it would be?

Xavier Phillips
Xavier Phillips

Didn’t Trump just cuck out on Iran when the real power in the MIC told him what a disaster it would be?
Reportedly he got upset because starting a major war would be seen as going back on his campaign promise of being a non-interventionist. Basically he wants to talk shit but he doesn't want to put his money where his mouth is.

Julian Anderson
Julian Anderson

Wait, so is he upset because he wants to start a war but can’t or is he upset because Bolton wants a war and he doesn’t?

Brody Cooper
Brody Cooper

The latter. He just wants to threaten war because it makes him look tough. He doesn't want to do a war because he campaigned on being against Iraq and that according to him if Hillary was elected she would have started a major war whereas he is the great deal maker that bring peace to the world and deserves a nobel peace prize.

www-m.cnn.com/2019/05/16/politics/donald-trump-iran-john-bolton-mike-pompeo/index.html?r=https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-m&q=trump+mad+bolton+iran+cnn&oq=trump+mad+bolton+iran+cnn&aqs=heirloom-srp..&rm=1

Washington (CNN) — President Donald Trump has become irritated at an emerging impression his hawkish national security advisers are marching him closer to war with Iran despite his isolationist tendencies, according to people familiar with the matter.
Instead, Trump is signaling his intent to speak with the Iranians as tensions rise in the Persian Gulf, and his national security team has taken steps they hope could facilitate a new diplomatic opening.
The likelihood of such an opening appears slim. But Trump has raised concern with the heightened rhetoric, believing a large-scale military intervention with Iran would be devastating to him politically, people familiar with the situation said. The President has told members of his team that starting a new conflict would amount to breaking his campaign promise to wind down foreign entanglements. And he's chafed at suggestions his aides, led by national security adviser John Bolton, are somehow leading him to war.

Bentley Edwards
Bentley Edwards

Wow, never thought I’d be on Trump’s side for anything

Xavier Nguyen
Xavier Nguyen

Trump wants to force Iran to the negotiating table, but Iran has made it clear several times that they will not negotiate with the Americans, for good reason. Some points:
- The US wants Iran to curb its missile program
- The US wants Iran to stop supporting Shia-proxies in the region
- The US wants Iran to never acquire nukes
All of these demands are about Iran giving up its military capabilities and deterrents. Basically, they are trying to coerce Iran into giving up its own leverage and severely weaken their own bargaining position in the future. In return for what, sanctions relief? Guaranteed by who? The Trump administration has already reneged on one deal and shown its willingness to disregard the interests of its primary allies. The Iranians have NO reason to trust the US in this matter.
In the meantime, the US have already exhausted most of their diplomatic options since they're already pressuring Iran to the max in order to coerce them into complying, which is not currently happening.
The result of this is that the Trump administration's coercive strategy against Iran is most likely going to fail spectacularly, barring two things:
1.) The US coercion is backed by a credible threat of war against Iran. Bolton must be let loose upon the Iranians should they fail to comply, or else this coercive strategy won't work in the now or future.
2.) The maximum pressure campaign of the US actually works to the extent where the Iranians become desperate enough to relent. This is less likely, IMO.

Joshua Nguyen
Joshua Nguyen

So what you’re saying is, war with Iran is….

Charles Jones
Charles Jones

The US doesn’t want war with Iran, they want Iran to close off the Stirght of Homuz. This will send the price of oil skyhigh, causing China and Europe to enter into a stagflation situation similar to what the US experienced in the 70s. But because the US is now an oil exporter when this happens they will ban oil exports and implement price controls to prevent this from negatively impacting them. this is also why they are mucking around in Venezuela the goal is to destroy Venezuela’s oil exports, not remove Maduro. If this plan succeeds China and Europe will be in economic crisis and manufacturing in those countries will be less profitable, causing some production to shift back to America, allowing Trump to get reelected for “bringing back jobs.”

Hudson Morales
Hudson Morales

Nobody knows, lol but I would say likely.
I could effortpost some more if you want to

Anthony Hernandez
Anthony Hernandez

Honestly I’d appreciate it, I honestly could see a US-Invasion of Iran as a possible catalyst towards WW3

Zachary Phillips
Zachary Phillips

Hmm, if that’s true that would make Trump smarter than liberals give him credit for.

However, how will that affect the political climate of Eurasia? I know things are tense.

Zachary Johnson
Zachary Johnson

Regarding war, the danger isn't that any of the sides wants a war. Iran doesn't, and the US doesn't either (at least not yet). The problem is that wars don't necessarily happen by design, but by accident. When tensions run high (and in a world where response times have decreased a lot), miscalculations can happen (like the one that nearly ended the world in 1995: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norwegian_rocket_incident). This is what the Europeans are fretting about, and why Spain pulled back its frigate from the Persian Gulf mission.

The US' desire to exit this ordeal without defeat (i.e., force the Iranians to the table), will likely lead to them continuously escalating in order to increase the immediate threat felt by Iranian leaders. This is their main source of leverage, as they've already sanctioned Iran to the moon and back. The Iranians have recognized this strategy, and are thus less likely to misinterpret US military build-up for now.
However, if the Iranians don't relent to US pressure, the US is left with two choices:
1.) Give up. This sends a signal to all other countries facing US pressure in the now or the future about US weakness - the US has no stomach for war, and thus US military pressure is just an empty threat. Consider a hostage situation in which you pull out your gun and threaten to shoot a hostage when your other hostages become unruly. Instead of backing off, the other hostages dare you to shoot. What do you do? If you don't shoot, your gun becomes powerless in the eyes of the hostages.
2.) Reinforce military pressure. This means actually using it in order to prove that you are willing to go the entire way. This doesn't necessarily involve an invasion, but more likely striking some Iranian assets, risking retaliation from Iran and thus increasing the likelihood of war dramatically.

Meanwhile, with tensions rising, any mistake or miscalculation (or unilateral action from some Iran-aligned militia or other proxy) can set off a chain of event leading to war, without there being any intention behind it. For now, this is the real danger. However, I'd say the risk of war is going to rise dramatically when both sides recognize the stalemate of wills going on, and the US has to show that it is actually willing to walk the walk. That's when the Iranians would have reason to suspect US military build-up is not part of the pressure campaign, but preparations for an attack.

Hope this made some sense.
t. got an A in international politics like 5 years ago

Robert Stewart
Robert Stewart

I wonder, with the two world wars, were those intentional and desired, or were they similarly accidents? Lenin wrote in Imperialism that WWI was inevitable and required for capitalist accumulation to reset, and I doubt that WWII wasn’t the same. I’ve read and seen about the territorial divisions in today’s world, with the Earth divided up between imperialists and without anymore resources for continued exploitation. On the grand scale it seems like a WWIII is inevitable, what are your thoughts on this?

Juan Ward
Juan Ward

oh i meant someone should kill bolton lel

Luke Wood
Luke Wood

Bolton’s mustache should kill Bolton

Luke Smith
Luke Smith

If this theory is true. Which is a big if, the effects would mostly be economic. China’s days of high growth rates would be over, and America would have a lot more time before they surpassed them in terms of who has a bigger GDP, as lower energy prices make America the better country for factories to be located, especial highly automated ones. This would cause a minor brain drain from China and Europe towards America. Europe would suffer from this, possible entering into a new recession, because of this NATO would be dead, and Russia would obviously benefit a lot from this. It would be killing America’s diplomatic dominance over Europe in order to ensure America has economic dominance over the world. Which I think Trump would be a-ok with.

Joshua Williams
Joshua Williams

Reminder that the UK is Satanic and USA is the Great Satan.

Trump got elected to make people wanna go to war with Russia. Germany viewed Russia as their friend and the only possible ally for defeating the Anglo but the Anglos funded Hitler and Fascism. Now they wanna defeat all possible resistance towards the values of the Anglos.

If I could go back in time I would give the German Empire AK-47's.

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Alexander White
Alexander White

Highly doubt this theory

Tyler Johnson
Tyler Johnson

Trump said the Soviet Union was right being in Afghanistan.

Trump, the guy people are being blasted all day long that is throwing kids into cages, causing the death of the planet, and is destroying America.

Brody Nguyen
Brody Nguyen

I just highly doubt the power elite in America want a suicidal war with Russia. I dont doubt they'll go to war eventually because America is fucking insane.

As for Trump, America had been doing that shit long before Trump

Jordan Long
Jordan Long

I just highly doubt the power elite in America want a suicidal war with Russia.

The main thesis presented by Guido Giacomo Preparata in his CONJURING HITLER: How Britain and America made the Third Reich (2005) holds as well for today about the second coming of fascism in the West as it did about the 1920s-30s with the rise of Hitler and the NSDAP in Germany. The same Anglo-American forces behind the rise of fascism in Europe during the last century are also behind it today as well because at all stages of this game it is in fact Anglo-Americans (and only afterwards Europeans and Slavs) who are promoting and diffusing any of this nonsense.

Thomas Parker
Thomas Parker

Hmm, I mean, dont get me wrong, I've no faith for the anglo barbarians, but you really think they wanna destroy themselves with a war against Russia?

Michael Perez
Michael Perez

They used foreign policy as a way to unleash their innate rage, limitless arrogance and their all-consuming delusion that they were superior and should rule the world. It seems that the policy was the result of some inherent psychosis that is an integral part of extreme arrogance and racism. There's no way that a policy like that, and tactics like those can sustain control; they can only destroy and achieve short-term success. Even if only high-level government officials of countries discover the plots, they will know they're dealing with dangerous and insane killers.

This is the attitude of a small minority that wielded tremendous power: the mechanism of any oligarchic society. A group that began in earnest with Cecil Rhodes, Edward VII and Alfred Milner and captured politicians like Balfour, Asquith, Grey, Lloyd George, Churchill and several top military figures. Of course there was the collusion of business and finance: the banks, the Rothschilds, Montagu Norman, governor of the Bank of England, the press and arms barons etc. and hoards of minor officials – this is the gang. There are also their minions and counterparts in high places in other countries. Preparata focuses on post-WWI, but gives a brief overview of pre-WWI schemes.

This British system of concerted chaos continues, having infected the American oligarchs, using them as puppets to continue the slaughter that they, being a toothless tiger, can no longer perpetuate. They've leached on to the American empire to create the Anglo-American empire. All their brilliant evil schemes ever accomplished politically was to lose them their empire, millions of soldiers and civilians, and reduce them to hollow pretensions of grandeur, solely and wholly contained in bad public television shows made for old ladies and fops. It did make many people immensely rich though and I think that's all that really mattered to them.

Adam Watson
Adam Watson

The 🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧Anglos🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧 are the eternal enemy of the Human Species.

Austin Ward
Austin Ward

Tbh I could see that, I remember Prolekult mentioning in his doc how Britain is in its death throes and seeking a violent alliance against Russia to save itself. Except I believe the Americans control Britain and have done so since 1945

Julian Johnson
Julian Johnson

They sink their fangs into the Left as well as among disparate groups of anti-Salafist Shiʿi and Sunni Muslims, particularly among supporters of the Resistance Axis. Rather than a legitimate alliance, this turn of events is arguably an attempt to muddy waters by certain behind the scenes power brokers that could potentially fracture (or otherwise neutralize) a united front against the Empire from the grassroots and eventually redirect it to more sinister ends.