Questions

Hey there, Zig Forums.

I've recently came to accept the deity of the Holy Trinity but I believe I have yet to become born again. I'm from a Catholic background and while I understand the hyperbole or even outright falsehood with which most Protestants attack our Church, I'm unconvinced I myself can remain a Catholic Christian. For one, it troubles me greatly that the dietary commands of Our Lord are being ignored, I'm thoroughly unconvinced by the arguments that Our Lord Christ has cleansed all meats; secondly, and although this this is a lesser concern of mine for a number of reasons, I don't understand the transfer of the solemnity of Sabbath to Sunday; finally, I'm a sedevacantist and I can't reconcile this position while remaining a Catholic Christian.

I'm still at the begging of my journey, I don't think that I have His Holy Spirit in my life right now nor do I believe that I am saved at this moment. While it pains me that I am still not in communion with my brothers in Christ, I want to have a thorough grasp of things before returning to church.

I thank you kindly for your answers and God bless. Please pray for my salvation.

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And on the next day, whilst they were going on their journey, and drawing nigh to the city, Peter went up to the higher parts of the house to pray, about the sixth hour. And being hungry, he was desirous to taste somewhat. And as they were preparing, there came upon him an ecstasy of mind. And he saw the heaven opened, and a certain vessel descending, as it were a great linen sheet let down by the four corners from heaven to the earth: Wherein were all manner of fourfooted beasts, and creeping things of the earth, and fowls of the air. And there came a voice to him: Arise, Peter; kill and eat. But Peter said: Far be it from me; for I never did eat any thing that is common and unclean. And the voice spoke to him again the second time: That which God hath cleansed, do not thou call common. And this was done thrice; and presently the vessel was taken up into heaven. -Acts 10:9-16
Seems like the Lord's dietary commands are being followed to the letter to me.

I posted this in a sede thread a day or two ago so i'll post it again here. We once had a pope who exhumed the corpse of his predecessor in order to condemn him as an invalid pope because of dumb rules about dioceses that were considered tradition at the time. They chopped off his fingers and flung him in a river, and the guy had to appear from heaven just to get a proper burial. All of this to say that the people who think that the VII popes are somehow invalid in comparison to THAT, not to even mention the Avignion or the Borgia popes, are just silly. To be honest it's quite strange that you would be considering apostasy while still being a sedevacantist. Would that mean that you still recognize the papacy as a God given authority, because if so I'm confused why you would be mad enough to abandon it or take issue with the Church changing the sabbath from the day of the Lord's burial to the day of his resurrection. You'll have to clarify your position a little better if you want to have a proper discussion on it; near as I can guess it just seems like you've passively absorbed some sede and adventist theology and are only now trying to parse it out. We'd be glad to help, we just need more to go on.

Romans 10:9 (KJV)
9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Ask Jesus he will give you any answers to any doubts you have

It was a sign for the Christ that was to come, the prohibition of pork was also an indicator of being beware of false communion. Eucharistic or otherwise. There is no reason to keep it after Christ, just like animal sacrifices.
We technically still observe the Sabbath in the Orthodox Church, during the Service. I think also in the Catholic Church. But it's not as important as Sunday.
One, because Sunday's the day The Resurrection happened. And because it's also called the eight day, the number eight has the conotation of "more than complete". And it's so because the creation of the World and the weekly cycle have 7 days.
The more than complete is important since Christ did even more than what was Prophecy.
Right, you can't.

Thank you kindly for all the responses.


My understanding of that chapter is that Peter was instructed to not refuse the gentiles since they came for him and he was bound by Mosaic Law to not mingle with them. Do you believe it also extends to the dietary law? Peter never ate those animals that were presented to him but he came to accept the servants and soldier of Cornelius which came for him. It is a beautiful story, but my interpretation is that Peter's body was the church and that it shouldn't refuse what the Lord Our God has made clean.

Thank you for reposting your words. You are right to claim some confusion on my part and that I have been influenced by Adventist theology. I understand that the current Pope isn't the worst we've ever had but I cannot abide by the evil that is him pardoning paedophiles and introducing further liberal theology on our church. In the end, the Catholic Church has become a sort of spectator sport to me, something I see myself and others gossip about or speculate as one would football. I dread this notion that the relationship I have with our Pope is one nearer to one I would have with Cristiano Ronaldo and his exploits rather than one I would have with a Spiritual Father. Can I remain a Catholic if I reject Francis' teachings?


Unfortunately given my geographical location becoming an Orthodox Christian would mean separating myself from the church and not having any fellowship at all with my fellow brothers in Christ. And the same goes to the dietary laws too, pork is ubiquitous here and seldom could I respect the law without becoming a vegetarian (even that would be difficult).

Again, thank you all for the guidance. God bless.

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Surrender your heart to Jesus, my friend.

Step 1: Shut up. Your own opinions are nothing.
Step 2: Pray the Rosary daily. If you are incapable of this, pray the Jesus Prayer whenever you have the opportunity.
Step 3: Read up on the lives of saints; follow their examples; do as they did.
Step 4: …
Step 5: PROFIT.

Are we learning form street urchins on how to talk to other people, now?


Mosaic Law is done for. If you follow Mosaic Law you saying that Jesus Christ has not arrived, we no longer bound by it.
If you believe otherwise then everyone is going to die since there is not a single Christian denomination who follows some of the laws dictated in parts of the bible such as Deuteronomy. Try to search for "remove evil form the midst of you" or similar phrases and see if you can possibly kill all those people that God orders you to.

Which ones?

Also bonus round:
If your interpretation is in conflict with the Church's interpretation then you're in a trouble.

Sorry, I didn't understand your post.
Do you mean you want to not pork but sadly can't?

Everything you need, here, from the 3rd century:

newadvent.org/fathers/0308.htm

Purity and impurity in the law of Moses is not about sin. Being impure is not a sin and even what makes you impure is usually not something sinful. The things that made the Hebrews impure were all things that were culturally linked to death. A Jew had to be pure to approach God, because otherwise, by having these symbols of death on him, he would insult the fact that God is holy (meaing "set apart") and His people is expected to be holy too. Purity and impurity was a symbol of the covenant between God and the Jews.
Why was the ban on impurity lifted by Christ? Because it is not what goes into one's mouth that defiles them, but what comes out of one's mouth. Impurity is only ritual and symbolic, but sin truly kills the soul, and we are in an era where we are intimate with God and have no more need for symbolic, educational things like purity and impurity. Just as how Sabbath was made for man, rather than man being made for the Sabbath, we can say that the laws on purity and impurity were made for man, to teach him about holiness, rather than man being made for them.

Why was the Sabbath celebrated? Because it was the last day of creation, the seventh day. By commemorating it we commemorate the whole of creation, and, you could say, mystically participate with God in it - by resting with Him.
But in Christianity we learn that the true final day of creation is the 8th day, the day Jesus rose from the dead, the day the clock of the end times began counting down, the day we became able to return to the original purity of the world and to attain theosis. Note that the number 7 in Judaism means perfection, but the number 8 means "beyond perfection", that is, God. And the numebr 8 is often relevant throughout the Bible, and the gospels make a point to make Jesus rise on the 8th day. This is the apocalyptic "Day of the Lord" that the prophets warned about. While the Day of the Lord is in itself the final judgement, the eschaton, Easter is mystically this Day of the Lord also - with Jesus's resurrection, all the righteous are already given eternal life and all the wicked are already given eternal damnation. And this is repeated every Sunday, the Day of the Lord, where we receive the Eucharist and are either awarded with eternal life or condemned with eternal damnation. The 8th day of creation is why we celebrate on the day after Saturday, why Easter is the most important feast of the year, and why the commemoration has shifted from Saturday to Sunday.
However it doesn't mean Saturday is not still venerated as a holy day. I don't know about Catholicism but in Orthodoxy we are not allowed to fast on either Saturday or Sunday, and also we pray for the dead on Saturday, who have indeed entered into rest.


This means both. Peter's vision showed to him that that which was not considered holy now is. This means non-Jews but this also means impure food and impure things.

cont

I'm Orthodox but my catechism says about the Church that what it *should be* is the beautiful bride of the Lord, the perfect and stainless community of the elects, but what it *is* currently is an ugly, disfigured bunch of sinners. But Jesus, even as He was disfigured by beatings and spit upon, was still the Lord of glory, even if He was repulsive to look at at this moment. And in God's eyes, what we truly are is what our nature is - which is why we remain "good", as in Genesis 1, even though we have fallen into sin and rebellion. What defines us is our final purpose, not what we are right here and now. The Church is ugly to look at but who else can make a change about that but us? In the end all will be judged and the bad weed will be burned.

Can't help you with that for obvious reasons. But again, if what you seek is a community of living saints here and now, you will seek forever and die without having begun to repent yourself first.

Thank you, friend. But right now I don't feel worth of His sacrifice. He died for us all and I vehemently reject the notion that the Jews killed Our Lord Jesus Christ, we all killed Him. God bless you, brother.


While I feel that you're being facetious, I do believe that the dogmas of the Catholic Church are put in place to protect our spiritual life. Even Papal infallibility has made sense historically. I do have some misgivings about the Marian cult but I understand the differences between latria, dulia and hiperdulia and see that the Protestant churches for the most part aren't sufficiently reverent to the life and sanctity of Mary. Having said that, titles like the Queen of Heaven are very troublesome and should be reconsidered in my humble opinion. As per the rosary, I do believe those are the vain repetitions Our Lord Jesus Christ warned us about in His sermon on the mount.


What about Mathew 5:17-20?
I want to honour His sacrifice but He has instructed His followers to keep the law. We are to observe the Commandments because they are good and they are just, so why are the lesser ones abolished? I struggle with this notion and I see that the better answer is found on the Messianic Movement, though some of my Catholic brethren call them Judaiser which is a concept I don't fully understand I'm afraid.

I thank you kindly. You have given me food for thought.

His forgiveness of paedophiles is extremely irksome and not something I can abide. The Church is the bride of Christ and the priesthood doubly so. Adultery is the only sin that justifies a divorce so with whose authority does the Pope Francis forgives these people? Is this a valuable teaching or heresy? I'm inclined to believe the latter.

I believe that the dogmas are put in place to protect my spiritual life. But I have a bout of the Gnostic poison and am always questioning. Please understand that I have no ill-intent, I mean only to comprehend before returning to church. these are contradictions I seek to resolve, it is not my intention to foment discord.

And again, I kindly thank everyone of the polite answers. Thank you for putting up with my silly questions. God bless.

It relates back to following Ceremonial Law when you shouldn't.

I'd reply to the rest of the post but has it in the bag.

That's good. Absolutely no one, not a single person, is or ever will be worthy of His sacrifice. Even if we become absolutely sinless, we are still merely God's creatures, so how could we ever be worthy of having communion with God? Yet He still emptied Himself out to take upon our burden and suffering and eradicate it while divinizing us in the process. The life work of a Christian is to realize how unworthy we are to receive God's blessings, and comparatively, how immense God's love is for us - and as such, how immense our love for our neighbors must be also.

I do think the title should be used carefully (if only because it incidentally lines up with a pagan goddess's title as mentionned in Jeremiah 7:18) but Mary being crowned as queen of the community of saints, and of the whole creation, is not so shocking. First, we are all called to be kings and queens, ruling over God's creation as we are images of Him, the only King. Mary simply got ahead of us on this one because she is the greatest saint. Secondarily though, in the kingdom of Israel, the queen was the king's mother. If Jesus is the king of the world, what does that make Mary?

Vain repetitions like those used in the Psalms? See Psalm 136 for instance. If you read the part where Jesus warns against repetition, you will notice the context of what He says. See:


Pagans prayed with "vain repetitions" because they believed that if they repeated themselves often enough, their gods would finally hear them. The repetitions are vain because they are empty of meaning, and they are wrong because they show that the gods the pagans believed in were not omnipotent and almighty. While praying the Rosary mindlessly is certainly bad (just as any mindless prayer is), the Rosary itself is not "vain repetition" simply because it is not "vain" to begin with, and the repetitions are not to get God to hear us better but to meditate on Him and beg for mercy.

Did you read the Acts of the Apostles?

Nothing is abolished, however we, as Christians, are a spiritual people, and we fulfill the commandments of God not always in the letter, but always in the spirit (that is, the intentions behind the commandments). The Jews may perfectly fulfill the law given to Moses but their heart is hardened, they do not actually become co-workers of God, or extensions of His hand into the world. The law of Moses was given to a specific people in a specific time, and furthermore God knew that until Christ would come noone would be able to fulfill the commandments of God perfectly, which is why the law of Moses is given as a teacher, pedagogy to tell us what God's holiness means and that we must dedicate our entire life to God. The law of Moses is holy, of course, but not the final and perfect appearance of God's will. We, as a people animated by the Holy Spirit, can fulfill God's will, even if it means infringing upon the Mosaic law (because parts became outdated in the economy of salvation, such as honoring the Sabbath or staying away from impurity).
Did you read the epistles of the apostles? They talk about this a lot.

The only silliness would be to not ask questions. Even the prophets asked questions many times. Some were even explicitly angry at God. Jacob got the name of Israel because he fought with God, and as Israel, we too should not be scared to wrestle with God to find answers rather than passively sit back and wait for salvation and wisdom to fall on our lap. Don't feel embarassed about asking questions about Christianity.

This was immensely insightful. Thank you ever so much.

I think I understand. Jesus was the Temple so He had to keep the Law of Moses so that He would remain ritually pure (anything impure would in fact be against His very nature). Our Lord Jesus eating pork would be akin to the desecration of the Temple by Antiochus.

Like I said the other user, I think that we all killed Christ. Not wanting to be to presumptuous. like there are lesser and greater people in the Kingdom of Heaven, so do I think we can measure our worthiness to the Lord Our God. I am especially unworthy, I haven't gone to church in over a decade, I have broken His commandments and my works are none. I do not believe I have His Holy Spirit. Perhaps someday I will feel Him in my life but now is not the time. It is easy to confirm His existence and His Messiah, but it's not enough to merely acknowledge Him. I'm still at the beginning of my journey, I've amassed years and years of sin and still sin daily. How can I rejoice when I kill Christ every day? His love is indeed great but right now it only brings me pain.

Only parts. I've only went through Genesis, Job, Proverbs and Revelation. I've read loose chapters of plenty of other books but I've yet to read the Holy Scriptures cover to cover..It is my understanding that the Orthodox and Protestant canons differs from the Catholic, so I hope I'm not missing too much.

I thank you all for your answers, they were more enlightening that what I was hopping for honestly. God bless you all.

Actions are very different from doctrine.

Actions inform doctrine.

Bad actions lead to shit yeah I agree.
But to answer that user no one needs to agree to the actions of a pope and God knows how many did even worse shit than this.

The actions of one man do not inform the 2000 year old, immutable doctrine of the apostles themselves. If so, dozens of Popes could have sunk the ship, but ultimately the are only the first mates and Christ is the captain.

All fair points. But the Pope is to be the supreme authority and the best possible example of the Faith. Regardless of there being worst examples, this is just unacceptable. The Bible teaches us that sin should horrify us yet these kinds of normalising behaviours have become our daily bread. We shouldn't be complacent, not as Catholics and especially not as Christians. This may be naïve of me but this is how I feel.

And its unacceptable when a pope does shit. But what can we do? Nothing except praying for him.

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