Given the Week of Prayer for Christian Unity just finished one or 2 days ago, and we haven't had a good old thread about this in a time, here's a place to celebrate what we have in common, so that "we may all be one"(John 17:21):
Anglicans are Chalcedonians so the agreement is meaningful to catholics and eastern orthodox
Grayson Martinez
I find it comical how much the Chieti declaration gives in to the Orthodox side. It doesn't even try to hide it.
Nolan Smith
It lacks any authority whatsoever. Its merely an advisory document.
Jordan Powell
I know, I know. If this was some kind of official statement from the Pope, the Catholic Church would have a major meltdown. I just find it funny how unbalanced that document is, even if I agree completely with it, being Orthodox and all that. Ravenna was more balanced, but whenever it said "we need to study this issue more in depth at a later meeting", Chieti answered with "oh yeah the Orthodox are 100% correct I guess".
Hunter Clark
Then you should see what the (((International theological commission))) said about Judaism in 2015 or the pontifical biblical commission says about them (they went to complete shit after Paul VI demoted them to an advisory organ).
Sebastian Martinez
So like, everyone agrees the bishop of Rome has some kind of special seat and the discretion to call councils.
Now that the excommunications have all been lifted and dialogue is open, do ya think if the Pope called a council and invited everyone, the EO and OO Patriarchs would show up?
Like what if it was over something rather uncontroversial theologically, like attempting to set a common dates for Easter or Christmas. I know there are some issues with the Julian vs Gregorian split, but we're not talking Aquinas vs Palamas here.
Leo Miller
I think the only conclusion to the post schism church is that all sides are in error, but reuniting can only occur through Rome, and only if Rome can reform herself which is I think the point of Fatima and similar apparitions from this past century. V2 was actually important to church unity but abused, there's also been lots of (((infiltration))) in the church and all of this is coming to light as the world prepares for a new order of Antichrist.
Eh, the Finns do that already. Wouldn't be impossible to change.
Chase Rivera
No.
Hunter Baker
Ukrainian Greek Catholics and Orthodox are a different story, they both share a common history of oppresion and persecution. It's only natural that they'll be much closer to each other now.
Elijah Adams
Eh. All sides excommunicating each other was error–it certainly lacked Christian charity.
Matt 5: If you are offering your gift at the altar, and there remember that your brother has something against you, 24 leave your gift there before the altar and go; first be reconciled to your brother, and then come and offer your gift. 25 Make friends quickly with your accuser, while you are going with him to court, lest your accuser hand you over to the judge, and the judge to the guard, and you be put in prison; 26 truly, I say to you, you will never get out till you have paid the last penny.
Jaxon Young
The Catholic Church was never nor will be in error ever. Ecumenism is fine, but syncretism no. Its pure heresy.
Joseph Fisher
That's not doctrinal error. Excommunications can be lifted whenever we want. If you meant errors in our atitudes from both parts yeah.
David Moore
No reason to extend too much kindness to those in error. Love doesn't want others to fall from faith, and the best form of kindness sometimes is to draw attention to danger. Else your brother falls into a pit. The Orthodox began to see a different "god" being proclaimed and had to point it out.
Why do I say they have a different god? The proof is in the putting. It's why they have Popes praying with heathens and Muslims. Because they no longer believe in the God of revelation. They've settled on a god based in ideals that are abstract and common to all humanity. Not the actual God of specific revelation and scripture (speaking of scripture, it's why your bible translations suck too. Like the NAB. It's made by people who don't even believe in it). These modern developments are simply the culmination of what the Orthodox already saw to begin with. It was kept under control in the medieval era, because the world was a bit smaller or not taken into account. But in our modern global society, the cat is out of the bag completely. You have a Catholic church that practically incorporates everything.. because it's first principles about their god were abstract to begin with. And it's dogma now speaks out of both sides of it's mouth - and doesn't care if called out on it. Again I say: The proof is in the putting. Your church wouldn't engage in these things, like setting up a prayer area for native Americans in the church of St. Gregory (or some pagan group. I forget… it's in that infamous Assisi video), or Popes kissing the Koran. The proof is in the putting (I'd repeat this a hundred times if I could).
Go ahead and tell yourselves there's no doctrinal error.. even with the Big Elephant in the room next to you. Or be a sede, who admits all of this, sees it for yourself, but schizophrenically chases after new popes and authorities..and ignores the other Elephant in the room, beckoning you to come back: The Orthodox faith. If you're looking to get out of this obvious mess, that's where you'll find your rescue. I know it's difficult, but the church will be waiting.
But the worst thing to do with be an ally with it.
One may claim that a tradition went in the wrong direction, but the problem is that it is literally impossible to claim that something that was proclaimed dogma is simply an error, without saying that the church that did this isn't the Church.
I don't know what world you live in, man. The excommunications and mutual anathemas are not lifted at all. The only excommunication that was lifted is that of 1054 and that's because 1054 was really a minor event full of idiocy and only concerned Rome and Constantinople anyway. The mutual excommunications of 1204 remain, the anathemas of Lyons II, Florence, and Vatican I remain.
Christian Martinez
Why even bother. Orthos clearly schismed from the Church and are just am assortment of bishops with varying degrees of communion between each other. Why even argue with schismatics.
Ryder Sanchez
because ye papists and your arrogant Pope Schismed first. Now look at your church: filled to the brim with sodomites, liberal Pope that doesn't care about the suffering of Europeans, and a hierarchy that is willing to throw teenagers under the bus so they can get soyboi points from the media.
Ecumenism is a dream that wilk only come true when that pope gets off his high horse and faces reality.
Christian Lopez
Well it's good that neither church will ask the opinion of a NEET user then
Isaac Parker
winnie the pooh off protestants can go suck a dick orthodox are fine for me
t. catholic
Xavier Bailey
I didnt bring the prots in this, though. The only bit about them is that the OO have common christology with the Anglicans, and by extension with us.
Andrew Sanders
Why even bother; Cats clearly separated themselves from the Eastern roots of Christianity… Do not create barebone straw men, please. T. Gadolig
Blake Perez
I don't think you should it's pudding, not 'putting'
Anthony White
Oh, hey. That's my patriarch.
sigh
We have churches that use all 3 calendars. It's not really a big deal.
Anglicans lost true apostolic succession a long time ago. We have an unbroken line, but our theological intention and rites are totally broken and heretical. The only way for Anglicans to get back into succession is to reconcile with Rome or Orthodoxy.
I vote we go Orthodox and become the English Orthodox Church. Anglican Communion won't last another 70 years in the protestant world.
T. Anglican
Asher Bailey
they literally do not have the apostolic succession. this isn't some arbitrary thing the Catholic Church throws around, they still admit the Orthodox Church still maintains it.
if you do not have the apostolic succession, they are not an apostolic church.
objectively.
Tyler Mitchell
God willing, that still can happen somehow. The Orthodox were willing to incorporate Anglicans/Episcopalians in the 19th/early 20th century. There was a wing of Anglicans still in love with tradition enough to see this as the right thing, but they weren't enough.. and now that wing of Anglicanism is even a smaller minority today. Anglicans/Episcopalians chose the other direction and seemingly got devoured by unbelief and indifference throughout the 20th century. The only choice now is just to flee completely.
I think the Orthodox are the only ones who benefited from any of these talks. From those times, it produced a service book (the Hapgood version) and had help translating the liturgy that was also intended for the hope of a Western/Anglican rite. The Antiochian parishes still rely on a lot of this KJV/Book of Common Prayer English… but it wasn't just intended for them.
