What is the earliest proof that orthodox Christianity believed in the Trinity? I'm not a Unitarian, but I'd like to be able to defend the doctrine against Bart Ehrman, Muslims, etc.
Early proof of the Trinity
Ah, maybe I should have said extra-Biblical… so Scripture like John 5:7 is out.
Chapter nine: ewtn.com
Irenaeus of Lyons basically gives a complete exposition of Christian theology, in response to Gnostic nonsense, and as early as the 2nd century.
But his 5 books "against heresies" are long, and I don't remember what parts would most directly show belief in the Trinity. Sorry. Well, books 1 and 2 can be ruled out at least, since they're mostly just expositions and refutations of the Gnostic doctrine based on itself alone.
I'm currently reading "Eusebius: The Church History" by Paul Maier, and the historian Eusebius (born 263 AD) speaks of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit as all being one God.
Thanks fam, have a rare Christina.
You mean Martina?
I think it better for you to learn from the Two Powers by Alan F. Segal and The Forgotten Trinity by James R. White. BTW Ehrman acknowledges that the early Christians believed in the Trinity.
Don't do this
god is 3 and 1 at the same time, where is the complexity? accept it as a rule!
I can't tell if this is a troll post or just pure heresy.
OP, here's a link to St. Gregory's writings on this very same thing.
The Angel of the Lord appearances throughout the OT. It's not a new idea. Even Jews once commentated (in the Targums) that the Angel of the Lord was interchangeable with God. Sometimes calling him the Memra (Aramaic: Word). Where have we heard that before? The Word… Yes, the Gospel of John. The Word was always a Jewish idea. And John himself was just a Jewish fisherman. Not some Greek influenced cosmopolitan Jew, as people like Ehrman would propose. And Jews only stopped teaching about the Memra because they knew it resembled Christianity. The Targums with the "Memra" commentary started disappearing after the first few centuries AD. I don't know why scholars have missed this.
I don't need to argue the whole concept of the Trinity though. Anti-Trinitarians are actually more opposed to the nature of Jesus specifically. The Arian controversy was always about Jesus. It's about denying Jesus' true nature or not. Once you get over that, the Trinity becomes apparent.
The Alexandrian reading of John 1:18 seems to offer a substantial and early support for the coequality and coeternalness of Christ but has been neglected due to being misinterpreted by anti-textual criticism observers.
No man hath ever seen God; the only begotten God, he who is in the bosom of his Father, he hath declared him.
I think he means Luthina
How about something earlier than the incarnation of Christ?
JW's don't claim special revelation, they just think Charles Russell's interpretation of the Bible is the correct one.
Don't they claim he got his interpretation through some kind of divine revelation
You can literally go to the earliest christian writings and see, for example, how they say that only God should be worshipped, and some paragraphs later that they worship the Ftaher, the Son, and the HS
Why is that?
How to debunk those claim the Church Fathers weren't authoritative?
Lmao this is not about what is authoritative, which you can find in the councils, this is just to show that the Trinity has been christian doctrine and though since the first christians
Chill dude, he's just Torring.