Soviet space program

The latter. The USSR was never competeing with the US so much as having a coinciding development. It's why their Buran took so long to make, despite having had the same data NASA had with their own experimental flying-body space-craft (like the MiG-105). They cared more about actual scientific achievement than a pointless dick-waving. They abandoned going to the moon because of that as well. The CPSU realized it was pointless PR and was instead satisfied with its superior remote land and return vehicle, which was less dangerous than a manned module

Couldn't the Space Shuttle also be used as a nuclear bomber?

Yes but it takes a day to fuel up and requires perfect weather conditions to launch. It has no practical application as a first or second strike weapon.

Do you have any documents on the superiority of the Buran to the Space Shuttle?

Don't be stupid. They fell behind by 1965 and then spent the next decade trying and failing to catch up. They only won the space race if you conveniently draw the finish line miles before the end. The fact that you then go on to defend their failures in the lunar programme shows that you are aware the race continued after the Soviets fell behind.

Lol, even the fucking Chinese have done that. Manned landings are a magnitude more difficult.

Wrong. It had a smaller payload and failed every time it was tested. They had to use a large number of small engines because they couldn't successfully develop big ones as used on the Saturn V, which ended up being a major factor in its failure.

Bullshit. What were the first woman cosmonaut, the first multi-cosmonaut launch (all crammed into a craft basically designed for one occupant), the first spacewalk (done with a jerry-rigged, almost suicidal airlock), etc. if not pointless dick-waving? Friendly reminder that they were on the very verge of a circumlunar mission in 1968-9 but abandoned it purely because the Americans had managed it first. Alexei Leonov would have commanded that mission and he is still seething about the stupidity of the cancellation today.

No, they abandoned it because the N1 kept exploding. To be fair they had never funded it properly to start with.

Is there anyone on this board who isn't dogmatically pro-Soviet when it comes to the space race? Please read this book before acting like you know shit:
archive.org/details/nasa_techdoc_20000088626

I have seen it recommended by Ismail so don't tell me it's biased against the Soviets.

buran.ru/htm/flight.htm

buran.su/buranvssts-comparison.php

The Energia rocket would also have become re-usable, however this was cancelled because of the fall of the USSR

Postin doggos in space

Attached: SovietSpaceDogsLarge.jpg (873x530, 194.68K)

Both the Buran and Space Shuttle sucked. The spaceplane concept was seriously flawed from it's inception and has been abandoned for a reason.

Bullshit. What is the Soyuz? What is the Mir?

First successful manned mission in late 1968. First managed to dock in 1969. Remind me what the Americans were doing at that time. What did Soyuz achieve that Gemini hadn't done in 1965?

You mean Salyut? Space stations amount to an extended mission in LEO which is not massively impressive in terms of technology

I said more advanced, not more successful.
themoscowtimes.com/articles/how-a-1960s-soviet-engine-appeared-on-an-exploded-us-rocket-video-40906
The engines were far more complex but also more efficient and more powerful in total than the Saturn V. If they had a similar construction budget to the US, they probably could have made their rocket work. In fact, the engines not destroyed at the program's cancellation were later purchased and used in a modern rocket, and their designs slightly improved upon for other rocketry uses.

Soyuz is still in use today as the best way to get into orbit. The soviet space program pioneered what would become the ISS. Both of them are a pretty fucking big deal. More than anything NASA has accomplished since they """""surpassed""""" the soviets.

The complexity of the engines was a big reason for their unreliability. They may have shown good traits but the rocket as a whole was less advanced, having a smaller payload despite its almost identical weight, and being overly complicated due to the inability to make a simpler equivalent. If the Soviets could have made a Saturn V they would have.

Who cares if it's still in use today? That's got nothing to do with the space race. And the ISS is the best statement possible of the lack of ambition in modern spaceflight. Is this all you've got? Like I said, dogmatically pro-Soviet, in the face of all evidence.

This entire post is bullshit debunked by this alone:
>russianspaceweb.com/book_future.html
The only thing convenient here, is your bullshitting What is the definition of the 'end of the line"?
Nope, they kept up, until the 80s, when the whole collaboration thing started. Even today, the USA uses the SOVIET made Soyuz rockets over its own and the SOVIET made space station, with its own modules being just a modification of the ones used by the USSR/Russia.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_space_exploration
Yeah, decades later.
remote controlling a robot to land and return is far more difficult because you lose the signal, you lose the robot, and the robot must be able to land without getting stuck and do a ton of automated things.
That wasn't the reason at all
You literally know nothing about the N1 yet keep asspulling meaningless statements.
- It's first-stage was the most powerful rocket built: raceforspace.co.uk/page1/page11/files/C8B04FC7-RfS_06_PRINT_lr 26.pdf
NK-15/33 Rockets are among the most powerful ever built and their “closed cycle rocket” technology was deemed too hard to perfect by US scientist during the Space Race. They were used for the Luna programme launchers and upon the programme’s cancellation, Soviet authorities ordered to destroy them. However, key people in the project decided to hide them in some obscure warehouse in the USSR. After the fall of the USSR, Americans got news about such rockets and Aerojet (a US company) bought the lot of almost 60 engines.
youtube.com/watch?v=TMbl_ofF3AM
- The original goal as cited as a launch vehicle capable of inter-planetary travel to Mars and Venus.
epizodsspace.airbase.ru/bibl/ziv/1997/4/per.html
Citation needed, even the fucking wiki page doesn't say that.
That isn't a race with the USA, the USA was the one who decided to do the same because they had to show that they were just as inclusive as the USSR.
This bullshit lie again.
This entire statement has no founding, and is based on statements by faggots like you.
>youtube.com/watch?v=9TMpxsZhpGs
>youtube.com/watch?v=P_gdqxo6JTo

Two videos that go over the film Time of the Firsts. It then proceeds to point out the lies and goes over the entire story of the Vozhod launch, from the beginning to the end. It was not suicidal nor jerry-rigged. The idea of a space walk in the USSR originated years before the US attempt, and the program started before the US attempt. They managed to test it repeatedly before doing the actual launch to make sure it was safe. Take your wikipedia bullshit elsewhere.

Attached: soyuz-blueprint-51332763.gif (2659x3900, 1.16M)

Dogmatically pro-soviet? The only dogmatism here comes from you. The soviet space program never fell behind the west and that is just a fact. You're the only one trying to shift the idea of what matter to better fit in with your view.

Gemini is a fucking farce. do you really expect me to believe that they stayed up for several days in fucking diapers (which they couldn't replace) and then when they landed, they were walking around like they had been having a stroll down Main street.
>manonmoon.ru/articles/st103.htm

Soyuz is the most reliable system built, and is used today, Gemini is not.

Obviously NASA and every other space program since they use them over their own rockets.
It has everything to do with the space race, becuause, as has been pointed out, it didn't stop at the moon. Soviet engines are still being used for space exploration, and things like Ion Thrusters (created by the USSR) are being looked into as well for the future. The USA's Saturn Vand other designs are not longlived, while the N-1 and other soviet designs continue to be improved and used as the basis for the future of space.

The base soviet rockets, the Soyuz series, hasn’t had a fatal accident since Soyuz 11 in 1971. Their launch escape system has only been used once, for mission 45 in 1983, which is also the only time to date that a launch escape vehicle has been used in any mission with crew on board. Everyone survived. They are now on mission 132. That makes it 111 missions in a row so far without a fatality and only minor issues since 1983.

The USSR pioneered many new ideas and technologies that are now the norm of today.

They also made the first guns designed to fire in space, and fired them too, the USA hasn't even been able to put one in space, let alone fire them.

popsci.com/this-soviet-space-station-fired-gun-in-orbit

Soviet Researchers provided a massive portion of what we know of Mars, Venus and other planets today, such as Vladimir Krasnopolsky who discovered Mars' ozone layer as well as the helium and methane content of its atmosphere. Unfortunately after the USSR fell he was displaced to the USA like many other Soviet scientists, unwanted by the new Russian regime

Current NASA uses Russian RD-180 engines and has been for at least a decade. Apparently they can no longer can reach the moon either. Space X has had mediocre success that cannot compete with Russian RD-180s.

this is fantastic material; do you have anything about the overarching mission of the soviet space program (what the OP was about)?

There is no definite end but the early 70s, when the most ambitious projects were abandoned by both sides, is where it is usually taken to end. It definitely doesn't end before the race to the Moon.

Achieved orbital rendezvous & docking several years after the US, never reached the Moon…

I've already addressed this. Just shows how little you have if these are the big achievements you point to.

Lmao, just lmao. That's why it was achieved years earlier, that's why even the Chinese have managed it. Manned is just hugely more complicated and demanding and if you don't understand that I don't know what to say to you.

The complexity of having loads of small engines was known to be a big reason for the failures. If they could have circumvented that by having fewer, bigger engines, they would have.

And yet the payload was smaller. That power was wasted.

The project had failed to bear fruit so they abandoned it. They gave it until 1974 and then had to stop. I've already given a source in my first post.

It was a fucking stunt. Tereshkova had no relevant experience, she was chosen simply to make a political point.

t. knows nothing about the Voskhod

Not an argument. I don't speak Russian by the way so those videos are no use to me.

>>>/marx/10468

As expected.

That's stupid. That would exclude the entire space shuttle program and the Soviet space station programmes, both of which had far longer-lasting legacies than the fucking moon landing did.

This is going to be a bother.
Then your statement remains false. the USSR remained on par til the end of the 70s. And was ahead prior.
Uhh, not they achieved that first, regardless, as I said the USSR did not take this whole competition thing seriously.
reached Venus and remain the only ones to have done so, and they reached the moon fine and got plenty of data. Manned or unmanned, it doesn't matter. Manned missions are ridiculous. Also you ignored a massive amount of what I posted on the moon.
Just an example of the data:
>russianspacesystems.ru/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/1973_Radiotekhnicheskiy_kompleks_Luna21_Lunokhod_2.pdf

No you have not. Just hand-waved it away because it makes your argument moot.
Both have their risks and issues, of equal measure, the difference is in whether human lives are lost or not. Manned expeditions for anything other than actual exploration (instead of just jumping down and then launching back) are retarded. The USSR was being pragmatic, the USA was not.
That is just plain assumption.
Not by that much.
No you didn't, you gave 1 book without any page citations or actual arguments.
She was an amateur skydiver and had to go through an entire program before being launched. She was chosen out of 400 applicants. Her flight went without issue. It was proof that a woman could go into space as equally as a man. That was the point, in a time when, in the USA women were GENUINELY having their careers limited, and were paid less than men for the same amount of work, unlike today. The USA decided to imitate this because they had to show how progressive they were so as to deny this point of progression to the USSR.
TL;DR Yes it was a political point, but it had nothing to do with the Space Race itself and was a proof of Soviet equality. The USA only responded because it had to prevent any pro-soviet sentiment or admiration.
Yes you know nothing about Voskhod. I read the books on it. However I cited the 2 videos because they provide exact excerpts on each accusation you made, namely how it was "jerry-rigged" and how it was "suicidal" When in fact the system was tested multiple times to prevent any accidents, and the only issue was, in the words of Leonov, a slight discomfort in moving around. Something that modern armchair asspullers like you blow into this whole "immobile" schtick, despite the video of the actual space-flight showing none of that.
It's called CC->autotranslate to English.
I said that it would likely be biased if it is recommended by NASA, not that it was. And I said that regardless, it's just spamming a book, I already repeated myself on that point.

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Do you have any documented proof of this?

With over 1700 flights since its debut in 1966, the Soyuz is the most frequently used launch vehicle in the world
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soyuz_(rocket_family)

Not the point. This is about the Space Race, which ended when both sides essentially gave up on further exploration and started trying to do things on the cheap.

I don't know what you think reddit spacing is, newfag. Maybe you mean the typo halfway down which I humbly apologise for.

Apart from the (at least) 5 year period when the main goal of both sides was manned lunar exploration, at which the USSR failed dismally.

No they didn't. Gemini did both first.

Yes they did. If you mean specifically rendezvous/docking, that is absolutely key to more advanced exploration and the USSR did take it seriously. In general they took the 'race' very seriously, to the point of abandoning projects if the Americans did that thing first (e.g. Soyuz 7K-L1)

These really go to the heart of what I'm trying to say. What exactly do you think the subject of the competition between the two sides was? Were they trying to put a man on the Moon? Absolutely yes. Were they trying to produce a craft that would still be used in 2019? Obviously fucking not. This isn't about what we think is best, it's about what they wanted to achieve. The very term 'Space Race' shows the desire to go further and farther. Your focus on stuff like reliability and longevity shows the failure of your side in what actually counted. And as I've already said, the ISS is a testament to the poverty of ambition in modern space flight. The Soviets who engineered the Space Race would be bitterly disappointed by what has come of their technology. They certainly wouldn't be gloating that Soyuz is still in use today, while their dreams of lunar and interplanetary travel remain unfulfilled.

Her flight was not a success. She struggled in comparison with actually qualified pilots.

My point was that you simply dismissed what I was saying about the first multi-cosmonaut flight as 'bullshit'. Voskhod was basically just the one-man Vostok with several people crammed in, not a new design. Meanwhile the Americans were pushing forward with Gemini, a project with an actual long-term vision.

Admittedly an exaggeration but it was not a long-term solution. It was already known that the future of spacewalking was de- and re-pressurisation of the craft, not a cumbersome airlock. They rushed the mission in order to beat the US to the first spacewalk (p469 of the PDF I posted). And Leonov became seriously exhausted in his efforts to get back inside.

No it isn't, read the OP
Nothing about it being exclusively in the Space Race. Nor is your definition of the Space Race absolute.
I know, you're doing it. I've been here for years back before the Zig Forums split.
Nope, lunar exploration? Sure, manned? Not essentially.
No, I mean the whole competition thing. It didn't matter who had the first air locks, at least, not to the soviets.
The USSR was, that was the main reason they abandoned the N-1. It was perspective, but its lack of reliability at the time made it a pointless venture, as it would be superceded with newer technologies.
That's a false dichotomy. Not to mention that the USA was the one always trying to stick it to the soviets.

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I wasn't responding to the OP, I was originally responding to this post This invalidates much of your post.

This would be reddit spacing. Nobody does your thing of leaving literally no spaces.

Unmanned was over and done with years before the USSR put huge resources into their manned project. And in terms of usefulness, they don't compare. The few grams of randomly selected moon soil samples collected by Soviet probes does not compare with the hundreds of kilos of hand-picked samples returned by the Apollo missions.

That's just ridiculous. I've already given loads of examples of how the competition shaped Soviet priorities. You still haven't addressed the 7K-L1 cancellation.

But you were saying that developing space stations (which are totally dependent on rendezvous and docking) was a major goal of the Soviets.

It's just a zero-gravity lab, like Salyut or Mir. No significant improvement on what was done 40 years ago.

You were talking here about Soviet plans of travelling to Mars.

Pic related.

How was it that much of an improvement from Vostok?

It developed rendezvous and docking. I keep going on about them but they really are that important.

The airlocks used today have far more in common with Gemini than Voskhod. You don't have to depressurise the whole craft but you have to depressurise a module of the craft, not stick a tube on the outside of the craft.

Please do not sage if you want to have a discussion.

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Could you faggots please stop writing quote-for-quote? It's a nightmare to read and a terrible way of arguing. If you're gonna have an autism-fight, at least write in fucking paragraphs.

Space isn't real, it was a CIA plot to trick the USSR into wasting valuable resources on a spook.

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This thread however isn't.
There is literally no reason to have ANY spaces, it's the reason Green and Pink text exist. Also, go to any thread and you'll see tons of large posts without spaces.
Hundreds of kilos? LOL also, the initial Apollo mission did not bring back that much.
1 example out of hundreds of various space-related missions.
Yes, but developing a space-station wasn't supposed to be a "haha we did it first". Doing it first was a bonus.
That doesn't make it the example of decay.
That's a technology people are only just figuring out.
Yes, with the fall of the USSR and the re-introduction of capitalism by Gorbachev and Yeltsin, Russian Space travel collapsed
All it says is that she didn't follow some rules and that Yazdovskiy wrote a "hypercritical" report
Compare the internal organization, it's freely available online.
The specific technologies used for that are no longer used today, with that level of argument, the Vozhod's airlock was long-term because airlocks are still used. The technologies in both areas are completely different. Only the concept is the same.
I don't care for this pointless argument, saging because this thread is a dead argument.

No

I'm not the person you're arguing with, but you can't just hand-wave away something like that

lmao nobodys gunna read all that about your fake made up space hoax